Is anyone else meh about suppressors?
- Thread starter Kobayashi
- Start date
If the government didn't restrict them, the demand would go up, production and supply would increase and prices would come down. I get both sides, but the government not wanting me to have it, makes me feel like I should have it.
DoglegArms
Silencer Dealer of 2015, 2016, 2017
I agree prices would go down but not significantly, not at first. Manf in the firearms industry pay taxes out the ass. Raw materials would still cost the same. Machines would still cost the same, maintenance would increase. There's only so many cans that can be made in a production run without purchasing more equipment and labor, which increases cost.
I'm a little embarrassed. I was just arguing against something that Dogleg didn't actually say...I thought that was game we were playing.
I think if people saw the machining at the factories like dead air or Dobbs they would see the massive amount of effort that goes into these cans. The amount of time and what your prospective total sales are really help understand the price.
My opinion is based on my experience with car stuff. There is no shortage of machined shapes like aluminum heads, accessory brackets, suspension pieces, etc that are more complex than an average suppressor. Cost by material volume/quality and time/complexity are significantly out of balance in comparison. Still, this isn't an 'anti-suppressor' thread.
DoglegArms
Silencer Dealer of 2015, 2016, 2017
I think every single silencer manf would disagree with you. There's great detail in the design of a can. Plus we're talking about SS and titanium, not only aluminum.
I'm sure they would, but they have a vested interest in pushing the perceived value of their product as high as possible. As well they should. Aluminum is only a single example for any industry, but there are plenty of exotic mixtures used in wide ranging application. Regardless, I'm only saying that I'm not sold on the value - yet. There are plenty who are, and the discussion brought out many ringing endorsements for your stuff.
I disagree for the most part. If they were deregulated you could make them in China for way less than $20 for sure. Stainless steel is not an expensive material.
Of course, if they were being mass produced by the thousands like the above mentioned automobile parts. Suppressors at least in the United States are manufactured in small batches by small companies and that keeps production costs high.
DoglegArms
Silencer Dealer of 2015, 2016, 2017
I agree. With more demand and decreased regulation I think prices would plummet for cheaply made suppressors. There would still be a market for premium cans for sure but if tthey were available for under $100 they would sell a ton and I think it would be possible. If Apple can make an iPhone for $200 somevody can make a suppressor very cheap. How much does it cost to make an oil filter?
It's really not as super high tech as these companies make it seem. I could build a pretty decent can in my basement for $100. Nobody is doing that right now because if you are already paying a $200 tax it's not worth saving a few bucks. Well actually some people still are doing that right now but not many
And almost all of them provide a lifetime warranty
DoglegArms
Silencer Dealer of 2015, 2016, 2017
Do it. We'll compare it to any HTA can and if yours is quieter I'll buy you the HTA can and tax stamp.
For years, I had no interest in suppressors. Mainly because they were expensive and partially because I didn't think I would have need for one. The juice didn't seem worth the squeeze. Now, I own three, with another pending.
Not everyone wants one or sees the value. And that's OK too. Some guys like revolvers, others like semis. Whatever floats your boat. With that being said, I think you'd enjoy shooting mine, so we're going to have to make that happen.
As far as materials and costs go, I'm certain that some models have huge margins for the manufacturer. And as a general rule, the margins for dealers is 2-3x the margin on regular firearms.
Baffle design hasn't changed much in the last few years and only a handful of companies are doing real fluid dynamics R&D to advance suppression design. Some would argue that it has plateaued anyway. Others are just copying someone else's design.
Materials costs vary widely too. Aluminum, SS and even Ti aren't that expensive. Inconel and stellite are more expensive and much harder to machine. The capital outlays for equipment like CNCs, EDM and robotic welders is tremendous. Not every company is using that sort of technology though, which is why we see rifle cans range from $400 - 900 in msrp. It's also why some cans look like a work of art and others look like a monkey was trained to run the lathe. The more expensive cans use better materials, boast better, more precise and stronger construction as well as usually having a much better mounting system.
Its nothing against you or anyone in the biz. Im not saying you can make the best can in the world for super cheap. Im just saying that the reason these things cost so much has more to do with the regulation (and the decrease in demand it creates) than it does with the actual manufacturing cost. Building a silencer is not rocket science. The technology has not changed much since they were first invented.