Does fixed front sight position on an AR matter?
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I think this is right. It's still 1 moa adjustments on the wheel. Height above bore is the main factor when calculating ballistics, much more important than any other factor. There isn't even that much difference between .223 and .308 until you get way out.
Late as usual. Getting ready for the gunshow this weekend. As others have pointed out, greater sight radius is an advantage in precision so go with your plan to put the front sight as far out as possible. As long as the sights are on the same plane it shouldn't be a problem. You should like the YHM, that's all I use anymore when installing a BUIS on the front. The shoot should be a lot of fun and I'm looking forward to it. I may bring a stock Colt R6600 as an alternate rifle.
See pages 11 and 12 of this critique of the M16A2 sight system/ammunition (M855 was new NATO ammunition for the Marines' M16A2 when I entered into my contract with the Army, I qualified my first time with a shot out XM16E1 in 1984 using M193 ammunition).
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a168577.pdf
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a168577.pdf
I'm no expert either so take this with a grain of salt.. I understand what everyone is saying about better accuracy with longer sight radius. Geometrically speaking, I think you are correct to believe the distance between the sight will affect the standard "come ups".
I think about it like this. If your sights are an inch apart and you lower you sight 1 click ( for demonstration purposes let's say 1 click =1 inch). that would equal a whole bunch of moa (like 45 degrees.) now say your sights are 100 inches apart and you adjust that same 1 inch click. Far less moa shift. Obviously that's an extreme example but it will make a difference. At least in my semi drunk mind.... Not sure if that made any sense.
I think about it like this. If your sights are an inch apart and you lower you sight 1 click ( for demonstration purposes let's say 1 click =1 inch). that would equal a whole bunch of moa (like 45 degrees.) now say your sights are 100 inches apart and you adjust that same 1 inch click. Far less moa shift. Obviously that's an extreme example but it will make a difference. At least in my semi drunk mind.... Not sure if that made any sense.
I think it will too, but maybe my clicks just go from 1moa to 7/8 moa, and I'm no where near good enough to be able to tease out that difference in the real world.
Right. I guess it depends how far off you are from what it should be and how many clicks you are adjusting. Being off 1/8 moa per click may be a bigger deal after 16 clicks your at 2 moa. I've actually never thought of this before but it's a good point.
Also if you know the difference in your sight radius and what it should be you should be able to figure out on paper how far off you will be. Of course there is always the old fashioned way..
Also if you know the difference in your sight radius and what it should be you should be able to figure out on paper how far off you will be. Of course there is always the old fashioned way..
The carry handle works adequately well from 10.5 - 20" barrel length. The velocity changes would have a greater impact than sight radius. It will work fine. You'll need to verify POI at distance anyway, so you could always jot down your come ups on a dope card.
Lots of good questions... ^^^ I love to give a SDM M16 class, ( classroom 1st ) The base sight setting for the M16/M4 is 300m. Thats why you shoot a simulated 300m target at 25m ( appx. 82 feet.) so when you go to the pop up target range, you can hit all of your targets out to 300m. problem is, there is all most 7 inches of arch of the bullet path, that happens at at 175 meters, so most people in the army have a hart time w/ the mid range targets 150m and 200m mainly, and they pop up the most. This happens for 2 reasons, 1st the target at 25 meters was zeroed too high ( you should be low on the 25 meter target to compensate for the path of the bullet, and 2nd most people tend to aim high on the target, insted of center mass.
Anything past 300m is where you will get your come up. ( like my examples before) remember standard Suit case sights are 1moa adjustments, but there are national match suit case sights in 1/4 MOA & 1/2 MOA adjustments... this is a way long talk, and I suck at typing... Anyone want to set up a indoor class for me just LMK...
Anything past 300m is where you will get your come up. ( like my examples before) remember standard Suit case sights are 1moa adjustments, but there are national match suit case sights in 1/4 MOA & 1/2 MOA adjustments... this is a way long talk, and I suck at typing... Anyone want to set up a indoor class for me just LMK...
Nice! I'm curious, what are your thoughts on using the 100 yd zero or 50/200, relative to trajectory, battlesight zeroes, point blank aiming, etc? I know they aren't what is taught as doctrine, but I'm curious about your thoughts vs the standard zero methods.
I have found that a proper 300m zero, if it do my work, will work for everything from the the army qualification, to CQB classes, to 3 gun shoots. But remember, I'm talking about man sized targets, not bulls eye targets... If your shooting some man size targets, the Army 300m zero is hard to beat. Once again, its a long conversation, and there is some personal preferences.
You sound a lot like one of the lead instructors at the KD. He is a big believer in BSZ and only adjusting for 400 and beyond.
@DarthVader, I will be confirming all this in the field and writing up a dope card. I'm sure there's math involved but I thought there was a "right" sight radius for the A2 rear. This is a gun site, and we don't spend near enough time talking them.
The right side knob is the windage knob, there is a way to market it when you have your 300m zero, and you can make windage calls at any distance and go back to your no wind 300m zero... Once again, hard to type, easy to explain. Not a lot of math involved w/ getting your iron sights set, just need to know your dope, for 400m, 500m and 600m. and you should be able to dial in your sights, and hit targets.
Return to zero is emphasized. Sight adjustments aren't magic, they're repeatable, and once known, you can go back and forth and know when you pick it up again, it'll hit where it's supposed to.
This is my first time trying it with an irons only AR. I've done this with scoped rifles, a garand and a M1a.
You should let me bring you to an Appleseed. If you like teaching riflery, we could help you with finding the outlet. It sounds like you have a lot to offer.
I'd go if you want to take me... I got spoiled at Ft. McCoy, get your rifle zeroed, go shoot it to 300m, or go to range 34, and depending what you had, stretch it out to 1200m meters... But I will say this my eyes have gotten bad, and need to find a Bob Jones sight if I'm going to shoot irons... If I dont wear glasses, front sight is clear, cant see the target... If I wear glasses, I can see the target, front sight is fuzzy... Sucks to be old...
Bob Jones sights are awesome. I've used a friend's M1a with one installed and the difference was amazing. I was going 100% on a 6"x9" piece of steel at 300 yards, seated rapid fire. With my M1a, I was 50% in slow fire prone. I've installed a NM hooded aperture, but haven't ordered the glass yet. Getting old isn't any fun.
Irons aren't a requirement, we just encourage them since it makes learning the fundamentals, especially NPOA, easier. Where do you live? I'll check availability in the area.